#25852 closed enhancement (fixed)

Add a deprecation warning to the legacy sage notebook

Reported by: gh-timokau Owned by:
Priority: major Milestone: sage-8.5
Component: packages: standard Keywords: notebook
Cc: kcrisman, jdemeyer, embray Merged in:
Authors: Reviewers:
Report Upstream: N/A Work issues:
Branch: Commit:
Dependencies: #26499 Stopgaps:

Description (last modified by chapoton)

As discussed in #25837, we should add a deprecation notice to sagenb. It has been de-facto replaced (at least the notebook itself, not all of its features) a while ago. However we never really communicated that to the user.

Before we move forward with deprecating the notebook, we should inform the active users of sagenb.

upstream pull request : https://github.com/sagemath/sagenb/pull/451

Attachments (2)

2018-07-13-180821_1793x887_scrot.png (170.7 KB) - added by gh-timokau 15 months ago.
screenshot of deprecation message
worksheet-listing.png (117.0 KB) - added by gh-timokau 15 months ago.

Download all attachments as: .zip

Change History (39)

comment:1 Changed 16 months ago by kcrisman

  • Cc jdemeyer added

Yes, and I believe at least 1/2 year is standard policy, though a year is probably better here. Luckily through a sort of process of osmosis this has slowly been communicated for a while.

This would almost certainly need at least some minor changes to sagenb. One could be fancy and have some javascript with a banner message that disappears and you can ask "don't show this again" but perhaps something more basic just hard-coded in to the main login and list of worksheets page would be easier and more obvious.

comment:2 Changed 16 months ago by gh-timokau

Yeah I think being a bit nagging and not that easily dismissable and forgotten might be considered a feature here.

I would personally prefer a shorter period of one or two releases before the notebook is made optional (assuming the necessary changes can be made in that time). We could then still give that optional package live support for half a year or a year.

comment:3 follow-up: Changed 16 months ago by gh-timokau

I created an upstream PR to get things going: https://github.com/sagemath/sagenb/pull/451

comment:4 Changed 15 months ago by embray

I would still suggest waiting on this until some of the issues mentioned in #25837 are dealt with. Although there probably won't be too many people, I might expect some complaints of "why are you deprecating SageNB when ___ doesn't even work yet anywhere else?"

Last edited 15 months ago by embray (previous) (diff)

comment:5 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

I think as long as we provide a link to the progress ticket that is okay. The ticket should make it clear that the deprecation is dependent on fixing all those issues. Getting the warning in as quickly as possible has multiple advantages

  • more time for end users to prepare
  • potential feedback from end users that are directed to the ticket
  • maybe even contributions from end users

comment:6 follow-ups: Changed 15 months ago by embray

I could live with a soft deprecation message, along the lines of "Development of the legacy Sage Notebook is transitioning to critical bug fixes only and eventual phasing out. Please see <informational link> for more details." As you wrote, perhaps solicit feedback on what features are needed.

comment:7 in reply to: ↑ 6 Changed 15 months ago by kcrisman

I could live with a soft deprecation message, along the lines of "Development of the legacy Sage Notebook is transitioning to critical bug fixes only and eventual phasing out. Please see <informational link> for more details." As you wrote, perhaps solicit feedback on what features are needed.

I can live with this.

Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

screenshot of deprecation message

comment:8 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

I deliberately kept the original proposal short. I am happy with your version. If you think its not too long, we can proceed.

Also is the login screen shown often enough for this to be effective? As I've said I have only ever used the sagenb once, and while testing this I had to actively log out to see this.

comment:9 follow-up: Changed 15 months ago by kcrisman

No, login screen is not shown enough; you would want a banner on the main listing page (no time to look up what that is now), which may yield some formatting/CSS issues to resolve in practice.

Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

comment:10 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

I have also added the warning to the worksheet listing. I've done it in the same way as the existing "Account is read only" warning is displayed (just a bit smaller), so there shouldn't be any formatting issues.

comment:11 Changed 15 months ago by chapoton

  • Description modified (diff)

comment:12 follow-up: Changed 15 months ago by jdemeyer

These messages sound quite different:

  • Development of the legacy Sage Notebook is transitioning to critical bug fixes only and eventual phasing out. Please click here for more details.
  • Achtung: Das sage notebook wird nicht mehr lange unterstützt. Klicke hier um mehr zu erfahren.

Personally, I prefer the shorter and more direct German wording.

comment:13 in reply to: ↑ 9 ; follow-up: Changed 15 months ago by jdemeyer

Replying to kcrisman:

No, login screen is not shown enough

+1 for two reasons:

  • For a single-user Sage installation, the login page is not shown
  • Some institutional installs of sagenb my bypass the login page to use LDAP authentication or something else.

comment:14 Changed 15 months ago by jdemeyer

Also, I would prefer to see the actual word "deprecation" in the English text since that has a more formal meaning.

comment:15 in reply to: ↑ 12 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

Replying to jdemeyer:

These messages sound quite different:

  • Development of the legacy Sage Notebook is transitioning to critical bug fixes only and eventual phasing out. Please click here for more details.
  • Achtung: Das sage notebook wird nicht mehr lange unterstützt. Klicke hier um mehr zu erfahren.

Personally, I prefer the shorter and more direct German wording.

The German version is a more or less direct translation of my initial proposal. I prefer that one too, but compromised to Erik's version. I forgot to update the German translation.

@Erik what do you think?

For the non-german speakers: "Warning: The sage notebook is in the process of being deprecated. Click here to learn more."

Alternatively even shorter (but some people might not like the "soon"): "Warning: The sage notebook will be deprecated soon. Click here to learn more."

comment:16 Changed 15 months ago by jdemeyer

The Sage notebook is deprecated.

comment:17 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

I think Erik's concern was that users will immediately go and complain that feature xyz is still missing from the jupyter notebook.

I think being as succinct as possible would be best, long explanations can be added to the linked ticket. However I'm fine with whatever the main sagenb maintainers prefer.

comment:18 Changed 15 months ago by embray

I'm fine with a more succinct message as long as there's substantial follow-up documentation. I'm strongly in favor of deprecating SageNB, but I am concerned about the number of things that still simply do not work well in Jupyter by comparison :/

comment:19 follow-up: Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

I've added a section to the tracking ticket (#25837). Is that combined with "This notebook is deprecated. Click here for details." acceptable for you?

comment:20 in reply to: ↑ 13 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

Replying to jdemeyer:

Replying to kcrisman:

No, login screen is not shown enough

+1 for two reasons:

  • For a single-user Sage installation, the login page is not shown
  • Some institutional installs of sagenb my bypass the login page to use LDAP authentication or something else.

I've since added the warning to the main screen too.

comment:21 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

  • Milestone changed from sage-8.3 to sage-8.4

comment:22 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

Do you have remaining concerns @embray (or anybody else)? I'd like to get this into 8.4.

comment:23 Changed 15 months ago by gh-timokau

  • Status changed from new to needs_review

comment:24 in reply to: ↑ 19 Changed 14 months ago by jdemeyer

Replying to gh-timokau:

"This notebook is deprecated. Click here for details."

+1 to this short and clear wording.

comment:25 Changed 14 months ago by gh-timokau

  • Cc embray added

If @embray also approves I'll make the change in the "upstream" PR and we can get that merged.

comment:26 Changed 14 months ago by embray

I don't know why me, but I'm fine with it.

comment:27 follow-up: Changed 14 months ago by jdemeyer

Maybe more precisely The Sage Notebook is deprecated. Click here for details

comment:28 in reply to: ↑ 6 Changed 14 months ago by gh-timokau

Replying to embray:

I could live with a soft deprecation message, along the lines of "Development of the legacy Sage Notebook is transitioning to critical bug fixes only and eventual phasing out. Please see <informational link> for more details." As you wrote, perhaps solicit feedback on what features are needed.

Because you asked for a softer/longer deprecation message after I first proposed my initial one. The second one was then based on your proposal.

comment:29 in reply to: ↑ 27 Changed 14 months ago by gh-timokau

Replying to jdemeyer:

Maybe more precisely The Sage Notebook is deprecated. Click here for details

I would personally find that confusing, because in my mind the jupyter kernel is also a "Sage Notebook". That is why I chose "this".

comment:30 Changed 14 months ago by gh-timokau

I've updated the wording. Please review.

comment:31 Changed 14 months ago by chapoton

Could someone (having the required rights) please now merge the 4 top pull requests in sagenb github, including the one related to the present ticket ?

https://github.com/sagemath/sagenb/pulls

comment:32 Changed 13 months ago by chapoton

Can we try to move this forward now ?

Should the pull request be closed before this ticket or the other way round ?

comment:33 Changed 13 months ago by gh-timokau

Pull request first, since this ticket is only really resolved once sagenb with the change is released and shipped with sage.

comment:34 in reply to: ↑ 3 Changed 12 months ago by dimpase

  • Status changed from needs_review to positive_review

Replying to gh-timokau:

I created an upstream PR to get things going: https://github.com/sagemath/sagenb/pull/451

it's merged, so as soon as #26499, where the new sagenb version with this PR in is to be released, is done, this is done too.

Last edited 12 months ago by dimpase (previous) (diff)

comment:35 Changed 12 months ago by dimpase

  • Dependencies set to #26499

comment:36 Changed 12 months ago by chapoton

  • Milestone changed from sage-8.4 to sage-8.5

comment:37 Changed 12 months ago by vbraun

  • Resolution set to fixed
  • Status changed from positive_review to closed
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